Is the universe infinite and eternal?

[Norseman]

Hi, I have great respect and reverence for Father Zeus and the forum community here at ToZ. I'm not trying to cause controversy or disunity.

I have a question that's been niggling away at me for some time now, before I came to the Gods.
I remember when in high school my science teacher said the universe is finite and one day all the hydrogen atoms will be fused and converted to other elements through nuclear fusion. This is a very long way in the future, perhaps 100's of billions of years, but it will result in the universe becoming cold and dark with no radiant energy anymore.
My questions are what will become of all immortal beings like the Gods when this happens? Will They move into another higher plane of existence? If not, then what is the purpose of immortality and the Godhood?

Only sensible answers, no wild theories or ranting on.
Thankyou

 

[FancyMancy]

Let me ask you this question - if the Universe began, where was the location in which it began? Where did "the big bang" happen? If the Universe ends, then that location in which it began would exist, would be there. The fact that... stuff exists means there was potential for it to exist. Potential, potentiality, is in one sense the most-fundamental, most-basic from which all happens. If nothing existed, then something would still exist - the state of nothingness; therefore, the absolute absense of stuff, everything, is impossible; potential was there "before" stuff existed.

If nothing existed, the state of not-anything still existed; the absolute absense of any and all things is impossible... so... stuff existed always, and all-wheres. I think there are also two universes - the Physical Universe and the Spiritual/Energetic Universe.

 

[Hárbarðr]

I remember when in high school my science teacher said the universe is finite and one day all the hydrogen atoms will be fused and converted to other elements through nuclear fusion. This is a very long way in the future, perhaps 100's of billions of years, but it will result in the universe becoming cold and dark with no radiant energy anymore.
My questions are what will become of all immortal beings like the Gods when this happens? Will They move into another higher plane of existence? If not, then what is the purpose of immortality and the Godhood?

This has been answered many times before. But to answer briefly: your science teacher and the theories of materialistic "science" are wrong. The big bang theory (and its associated "big crunch", what your "science teacher" described) is a jewish hoax. The universe always existed and always will.

Read this post by HP Maxine where she explained it:

Lilith appeared to me. This was right after I read in the book concerning
the "Big Bang" theory and how the universe is supposedly "15 billion years
old." Now, note again..."15 billion" again, the number 1 + 5 = 6. She told
me that "Big Bang" theory was a total crock of shit. I then went on to ask
about the universe, the micro and macrocosms and such and she told me
this...she stated that because we live and die; birth and death, we often
see things in a linear time perspective...in having a beginning and an end.
She said the universe and the micro and macrocosms do not correspond to
linear time. They do not have a beginning or an end. She also stated what
Thoth said about the universe being triangular shaped. She then went on and
told me how science and everything else has been held back and stymied by
the Jews.

That theory concerning the universe being 15 billion years old is based on
Einstein's crap. Again, Jewish lies. This in turn is based upon their stupid
torah and then we have the muslim idiots who refuse to admit that the earth
is older than what is stated in the koran, like the kikes- so all scientific
enquiry is scarfed and stymied [Jewish roots]. I read some time ago where
professors and other important scholars, if they do not conform to what are
deemed accepted teachings, in many cases, even in spite of research, they
are given a strong warning, then they are ostracized and eventually cut from
their positions, if they persist. Certain research and such is taboo.

Well, she then left and I went on reading and that book even stated that
before Einstein's theory, the general belief was exactly what Lilith told
me- the universe had no beginning or end.

See how they ruin science? No different from how I read many years ago how
they have NASA completely under their control.

Something of Interest

I know many people have a lot of questions about science, the universe and life. I am posting this, as it may be of interest. I majored in the physical sciences when I attended university many years ago. Satanism is for the advancement of science. Humanity has failed to make any serious...

ancient-forums.com

 

[չ∂αяквℓσω]

This has been answered many times before. But to answer briefly: your science teacher and the theories of materialistic "science" are wrong. The big bang theory (and its associated "big crunch", what your "science teacher" described) is a jewish hoax. The universe always existed and always will.

Read this post by HP Maxine where she explained it:

Something of Interest

I know many people have a lot of questions about science, the universe and life. I am posting this, as it may be of interest. I majored in the physical sciences when I attended university many years ago. Satanism is for the advancement of science. Humanity has failed to make any serious...

ancient-forums.com

I read that the universe had a sort of triangular shape, although I don't think I understood the concept well, if it had a shape then it would have to be contained in something and what would that something be?

 

[GoldenxChild1]

The Universe is eternal and infinite—modern science only provides theories about the Universe.

 

[Norseman]

Thanks everyone for your replies

 

[FancyMancy]

The recent acceptance of the "age" of the Universe was 13.7bn years old, and for a time it was estimated to be between 13.7 byo and 15 byo hence Lady Maxine referring to the 15byo age being 6 in numerology, which is a number the jew loves to use; now, with the JWST showing us that there are galaxies which are much older than "when" "the big bang" "happened", it was said that the Universe is something like 26byo...


My Conversation with an AI Chatbot
JWST and Universe Age

Was there a time when people thought the Universe was 15 billion years old?
After the JWST discovered galaxies which appear to be too old to have formed, meaning they would have formed before the time when the big bang is said to have happened, there was mention of the Universe being something like 26 billion years old or so.

Yes, for a long time, the commonly accepted age of the Universe was estimated to be around 13.7 to 15 billion years, based on observations from telescopes like the Hubble Space Telescope and measurements of the cosmic microwave background (CMB) by missions like WMAP and Planck.

Historical Timeline of Universe Age Estimates:​

• 1990s – early 2000s: Estimates ranged from 12 to 15 billion years, largely constrained by globular cluster ages and the expansion rate (Hubble constant).
• 2013 (Planck Mission): Estimated the age of the Universe at 13.81 billion years, with high precision.
• Until recently: This figure (~13.8 billion years) has been the standard in cosmology.

JWST and the "Too-Old" Galaxies​

After the James Webb Space Telescope (JWST) began operations in 2022, it observed galaxies at very high redshifts (z > 10), meaning they appeared to exist just 200–300 million years after the Big Bang. Some of these galaxies:

• Appeared too large and evolved to have formed so soon after the Big Bang under current cosmological models.
• Led to speculative headlines suggesting that the standard ΛCDM model (Lambda Cold Dark Matter) may need revision.

This does not yet mean the Universe is definitively older than 13.8 billion years, but it sparked alternative theories, including:

• A 2023 paper by Rajendra Gupta, who proposed that the Universe might actually be 26.7 billion years old, by modifying standard cosmological interpretations. His idea involves “tired light” mechanisms and reinterpreting redshift, but this is highly speculative and not widely accepted.
  

Summary:​

• Yes, there was a time the Universe was thought to be ~15 billion years old.
• JWST's discoveries have challenged aspects of early galaxy formation models.
• The claim of a 26 billion-year-old Universe comes from a minority speculative model, not the scientific consensus.
• As of now, the accepted age of the Universe is still about 13.8 billion years.

Here, I enabled "Reason", which makes it consider and gives better results, along with my prompt.

Spoiler: ChatGPT's "Reason"

The "Reason" tool in ChatGPT is designed to help the model provide more thoughtful and detailed responses by showing its reasoning process. However, it can sometimes lead to excessive details that may reduce readability and slow down the user experience.

OpenAI Developer Community

Connect with other developers building with the OpenAI API Platform.

community.openai.com

~duckduckgo's "Assist"/duck.ai

The New ChatGPT Reason Feature: What It Is and Why You Should Use It
Ultimately, the Reason feature helps ChatGPT shift from being a tool for quick answers to becoming a more powerful assistant in critical thinking, decision-making, and learning. Conclusion. In conclusion, the Reason feature is a thoughtful addition to ChatGPT's functionality, offering users the...

The New ChatGPT Reason Feature: What It Is and Why You Should Use It

Daily Tech News & Tutorials

www.tech-reader.blog

Check your response above and verify with sources.

Spoiler: Thought for 18 seconds

Searched the web
︎ Rajendra Gupta universe 26.7 billion years tired light paper

Our Universe is 26.7 Billion Years Old, Astrophysicist Claims | Sci.News

The Universe could be twice as old as current estimates, according to new research from the University of Ottawa.

www.sci.news

https://academic.oup.com/mnras/article/524/3/3385/7221343

Physicist Claims Universe Has No Dark Matter And Is 27 Billion Years Old

Sound waves fossilized in the maps of galaxies across the Universe could be interpreted as signs of a Big Bang that took place 13 billion years earlier than current models suggest.

www.sciencealert.com

Could the age of the universe be twice as old as current estimates suggest? | Penn Today

Penn Professors Vijay Balasubramanian and Mark Devlin offer a broader understanding of a recent paper’s claim that the universe could be 26.7 billion years old.

penntoday.upenn.edu

New research puts age of the Universe at 26.7 billion years

The article https://phys.org/news/2023-07-age-universe-billion-years-previously.html#:~:text=42-,New%20research%20puts%20age%20of%20universe%20at%2026.7%20billion%20years,as%20old%20as%20previously%20believed&text=Our%20universe%20could%20be%20twice,%22impossible%20early%20galaxy%20problem.%22...

www.physicsforums.com

Is the Universe 13.8 or 26.7 billion years old?

For many years, cosmologists have claimed the Universe is 13.8 billion years old. A new paper says no, it’s 26.7 billion. How do we decide?

medium.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/1bhonms/study_dark_matter_does_not_exist_and_the_universe

Why It's Extremely Unlikely The Universe Is 26.7 Billion Years Old

A new claim has attracted a lot of media, but other scientists say it’s up against a mountain of competing evidence.

www.iflscience.com

How Old is the Universe? Examining a New Study

Introduction

drbriankeating.medium.com

The Hubble Space Telescope (HST) key project initially gave a value for H0, which was tied to constraints that estimate the universe's age to be roughly 14 billion years, though with some level of uncertainty. Actually, there are also globular clusters that appear older, complicating things. To figure out more, I’ll search for estimates connecting the Hubble constant with the age of the universe, particularly to see if newer findings suggest a 15 billion year estimate.

Searched the web
︎ 1990s universe age 15 billion globular clusters Hubble constant estimates

Imagine the Universe!

This site is intended for students age 14 and up, and for anyone interested in learning about our universe.

imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov

29.1 The Age of the Universe | Astronomy

courses.lumenlearning.com

The Age of the Universe | Astronomy 801: Planets, Stars, Galaxies, and the Universe

Cosmic age problem - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.94.13.6579

Hubble Space Telescope Begins To Provide Accurate Distances to Galaxies - NASA Science

Using NASA's Hubble Space Telescope (HST), an international team of astronomers has taken a major first step in redetermining the expansion rate of the

hubblesite.org

The age of the universe

How can we figure out when the universe began?

www.symmetrymagazine.org

The Standard Model of Cosmology: A Skeptic's Guide - D. Scott

paper

ned.ipac.caltech.edu

This Old Universe

Until now, astronomers were unsure about how old the universe is. They knew it was old enough to drive, and could even buy beer, but estimates varied widely -- anywhere from 10 million years to 20 billion years. Now, aided by the Hubble Space Telescope, which has been tracking something called...

www.wired.com

Searched the web
︎ Planck 2018 cosmic microwave background age Universe 13.81 billion years

APOD: 2018 July 22 - Planck Maps the Microwave Background

A different astronomy and space science related image is featured each day, along with a brief explanation.

apod.nasa.gov

Planck reveals an almost perfect Universe

Acquired by ESA’s Planck space telescope, the most detailed map ever created of the cosmic microwave background – the relic radiation from the Big Bang – was released today revealing the existence of features that challenge the foundations of our current understanding of the Universe.

www.esa.int

Universe is 13.77 Billion Years Old, Astronomers Say | Astronomy | Sci-News.com

Astronomers using NSF’s Atacama Cosmology Telescope (ACT) have taken a fresh look at the Cosmic Microwave Background (CMB), the oldest light in our Universe.

www.sci.news

Answers About Universe’s Age Could Be Found in the Dark | Physics & Astronomy | University of Pittsburgh

In May 2009, the Planck Satellite was launched with a mission to discover the age of the universe. The goal was to measure cosmic background radiation (CMB), a source of light that traces back to around 380,000 years after the universe’s start at the Big Bang. Those measurements revealed the...

www.physicsandastronomy.pitt.edu

Scientists Confirm Age of Universe is 13.8 Billion Years - SBU News

The universe is about 13.8 billion years old, according to new research published in a series of papers by an international team of astrophysicists, including Stony Brook’s Neelima Sehgal. Using observations from the Atacama Cosmology Telescope (ACT) in Chile, their findings confirm previous...

news.stonybrook.edu

Planck Mission Updates the Age of the Universe and What it Contains - Berkeley Lab

At a March 21 NASA telephone news conference, scientists from the U.S. team participating in the European Space Agency’s Planck mission to map the cosmic microwave background (CMB) discussed Planck’s first cosmological results, including some surprising news. For one thing, the universe is 13.82...

newscenter.lbl.gov

Planck (spacecraft) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

New Map Made of First Trillionth of a Trillionth of a Second After Big Bang

The European Space Agency's Planck satellite has released the most detailed map of the universe ever created, refining estimates of the age of the universe and its composition, as well as showing some interesting anomalies that scientists can't yet explain.

www.wired.com

🗸 Done

Here’s a fact-checked rundown of each point:

1. Historical estimates of ∼15 billion years
   
   • Before the Hubble Space Telescope (HST) measured Cepheid distances, values of the Hubble constant (H₀) ranged widely enough that the implied “Hubble time” (1/H₀) lay between about 10 and 20 Gyr, with a convenient round figure of 15 Gyr often quoted for H₀≈20 km s⁻¹ Mpc⁻¹ Lumen Learning.
   • Likewise, ages of the oldest globular clusters were originally estimated at up to 15–17 Gyr (which even briefly created a “cosmic age problem” when H₀ implied a younger universe) ned.ipac.caltech.edu, Dutton Institute.
2. Precise modern value: ≃13.8 billion years
   
   • WMAP’s nine-year CMB data gave ~13.75 ± 0.11 Gyr WIRED.
   • ESA’s Planck “2018 final” release pins the age at 13.82 ± 0.02 Gyr (TT, TE, EE + lensing + BAO) European Space Agency, Wikipedia.
3. JWST’s “too-old” galaxies
   
   • JWST has imaged galaxies at redshifts z≳10–15, corresponding to 200–400 Myr after the Big Bang Sci.News: Breaking Science News.
   • Some of these objects appear unexpectedly massive or evolved for that early epoch, rekindling questions about our models of rapid early galaxy formation Oxford Academic.
4. The “26 billion-year-old Universe” claim
   
   • In mid 2023, Rajendra Gupta (Univ. of Ottawa) published a speculative ΛCDM+tired-light hybrid model that reinterprets redshift and lets fundamental couplings vary, yielding an age of 26.7 Gyr Sci.News: Breaking Science News, ScienceAlert.
   • This remains a fringe proposal: it relies on a discredited “tired light” mechanism and is not accepted by mainstream cosmologists, who point out that the CMB, supernovae, large-scale structure and stellar ages all coherently support ~14 Gyr IFLScience.

Bottom line:

• Yes—through the 1990s, “15 billion years” was a typical ballpark.
• Since HST, WMAP and Planck, the consensus age is about 13.8 billion years.
• JWST’s discovery of mature-looking galaxies at z>10 poses interesting formation puzzles but does not necessitate a 26 Gyr Universe.

Spoiler: Sources

Lumen Learning
29.1 The Age of the Universe | Astronomy - Lumen Learning
Estimates for the Hubble constant are actually closer to 21 or 22 kilometers/second per million light-years, which would make the age closer to 14 billion years ...

ned.ipac.caltech.edu
The Standard Model of Cosmology: A Skeptic's Guide - D. Scott
In the early 90s the oldest clusters were stated to be perhaps 17 billion years old, with lower limits at around the 15 billion year level. However, in ...

Dutton Institute
The Age of the Universe | Astronomy 801 - Dutton Institute - Penn State
From stellar evolution, we have estimated the ages of the oldest globular clusters to be approximately 12-13 billion years old.


WIRED
New Look at Big Bang Radiation Refines Age of Universe
February 3, 2010 — Researchers have utilized data from NASA's Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) to produce the most precise determination of the universe's age, direct detection of primordial helium, and confirmation of signatures of the inflation theory. The findings, released in six papers, reveal that the cosmos is approximately 13.75 billion years old, with an uncertainty of 0.11 billion years. The analysis supports the inflation theory, indicating rapid expansion in the universe's early moments, and aligns with the standard cosmological model involving dark matter and dark energy. Additionally, the study confirmed helium formation in the early universe and examined the diversity of neutrino particles, suggesting the possible existence of a fourth type. However, discrepancies were observed in the behavior of cosmic microwaves near galaxy clusters, indicating a need for revised galaxy cluster theories. These results enhance cosmological understanding and provide robust support for existing models.


European Space Agency
Planck reveals an almost perfect Universe - ESA
The data imply that the age of the Universe is 13.82 billion years. “With the most accurate and detailed maps of the microwave sky ever made, Planck is ...

Wikipedia
Planck (spacecraft)
3 days ago

Sci.News: Breaking Science News
Our Universe is 26.7 Billion Years Old, Astrophysicist Claims
July 11, 2023 — Fritz Zwicky's tired light theory proposes that the redshift of light from distant galaxies is due to the gradual loss of energy by photons over ...


Oxford Academic
JWST early Universe observations and ΛCDM cosmology
July 7, 2023 — Our main objective in this paper is to explore if hybrid tired light and expanding Universe models can resolve the impossible early galaxy ...

ScienceAlert
Physicist Claims Universe Has No Dark Matter And Is 27 Billion ...
March 18, 2024 — Gupta's latest analysis suggests oscillations from the earliest moments in time preserved in large-scale cosmic structures support his claims. " ...

IFLScience
Why It's Extremely Unlikely The Universe Is 26.7 Billion Years Old
July 20, 2023 — Dr Rajendra Gupta of the University of Ottawa, however, has thrown such considerations out and published a paper arguing the true age of the

__________________

Since it was 26.7 billion years, that makes it closer to 27 than to 26 as I first remembered, which equals 9 in numerology. 13.8=3 in numerology. In 10, 50, 100 years, if current trends continue, by my randomly-wild guess of pulling numbers out of thin-air, the Universe will, then, be 13.8x2=27.6byo, then x2=55.2byo, then x2=110.4byo... ad infinitum, ad nauseam, ad idioticum; alternatively, all of the scientific discoveries will be "proven wrong", and the age of the Universe would merely be 6000 years old and all dinosaur fossils were placed there by Satan and "god" "allowed" Him to do that to test us, and all fossils and skeletons otherwise (of trilobites, of Humans, etc.) will all also be fake and made from... fibreglass and asbestos or something...

They tell us that the "too-old" galaxies formed very quickly, very unusually. In real life, one might argue that they formed before "the big bang". For all we know, a jew-infested Planet 13.8 billion lightyears away (oh, wait - that's differnet than age, regarding the speed of light and the size of the entire Universe... but whatever) has detected our galaxy to also be from "before the big bang" and are saying "nah, lol, it formed 1 millisecond after 'god' farted the Universe into existence, but our galaxy is only 6000 years old, lol!" at the same time...