IMPORTANT: Changes to New Accounts and Private Messages

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

Everyone, we have altered how new users may interact with the forum.

Newly registered accounts will now not be allowed to send private messages, nor will they be allowed to make profile posts.

These restrictions are lifted upon you making 30 posts.

Everything should work automatically. If your account has over 30 posts and you cant send messages still try logging out, and then back in.

If it still isn't working, let me know over email ([email protected])

Thank you

 

[WiseDragon]

Thank you. In my opinion it would've been better if the number of posts needed to write private messages would've been higher, like 50 for example. A new account shouldn't need to send private messages anyway, for the most part.

 

[Caspian]

This could be a good way of knowing more about the person behind the account since they actually have to make known their stance on subjects, and from there people can determine if they are even trustworthy or not...

Unless, well, they totally lie and pretend they are with us while they are against us. Hopefully this will be unlikely so I advise to not trust new accounts that private message you completely. Even if they have made 10+ posts

 

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

Thank you. In my opinion it would've been better if the number of posts needed to write private messages would've been higher, like 50 for example. A new account shouldn't need to send private messages anyway, for the most part.

Yeah, this is open to change of course and we'll be watching it carefully.

This could be a good way of knowing more about the person behind the account since they actually have to make known their stance on subjects, and from there people can determine if they are even trustworthy or not...

Unless, well, they totally lie and pretend they are with us while they are against us. Hopefully this will be unlikely so I advise to not trust new accounts that private message you completely. Even if they have made 10+ posts

It is entirely possible to still play it safe for 10 posts to start harassing people, however we are also watching this too.

If anyone receives a weird DM luring them to a discord or some other shit, just report the DM or user, and we'll take care of it.

 

[Dragonheart666 🧘♀️🦚]

Thank you. I think this would make things a lot easier for me and many others on here to protect their stuff and their information. Who we are on here is an individual. Especially when we are dealing with the Enemy At Its worst. And with Israel the way it is anything is bound to happen. The Jews are capable of pulling anything out of their sleeve. And we just barely got this website up and going as it is. And we are still dealing with problems. People nowadays are so unpredictable and it pays to be safe.

 

[Caspian]

Yeah, this is open to change of course and we'll be watching it carefully.



It is entirely possible to still play it safe for 10 posts to start harassing people, however we are also watching this too.

If anyone receives a weird DM luring them to a discord or some other shit, just report the DM or user, and we'll take care of it.

It is good that the mail option exists, since governments can actually harass ppl by going undercover and finding out someone's IP address through their email header. This has happened before in here. I'm personally grateful for this option.

 

[Hellenic SS]

Thank you for this. As other people have mentioned, the restriction should be higher. I would suggest 40 messages. 95% of trolls would be bored and/or tired by that point and would simply leave the Forums. Regardless, this is a great step towards a secure future for our members.

 

[Dragonheart666 🧘♀️🦚]

So are we all supposed to create a new profile? Or just keep the one we've got? What are we supposed to do ..?

 

[FancyMancy]

Won't a jew or a troll create an account, make 10 decent posts, then PM newbs and others who post certain things, and lie to them and drive them away from here?

 

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

Won't a jew or a troll create an account, make 10 decent posts, then PM newbs and others who post certain things, and lie to them and drive them away from here?

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

 

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

So are we all supposed to create a new profile? Or just keep the one we've got? What are we supposed to do ..?

If you made a new profile you would start all the way over at the bottom, I never mentioned making a new accounts. This is for new people joining the forum going forward from now.

 

[Dragonheart666 🧘♀️🦚]

Awe okay. Thank you for explaining.

 

[Ol argedco luciftias]

Maybe some kind of combination between post count and physical amount of time since the account was created.

Anyway, thank you for this. Exact amounts could be debated endlessly with no perfect answer, but anything is a great improvement over nothing.

 

[FancyMancy]

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

I understand the want to have PMs enabled, but it doesn't need to be. I think it is a bad idea altogether. 1 post, 10 posts, 100 posts, 1000 posts... as you say, a dedicated shitposter would work. Just look at majewson, as one example. By law, for data protection and privacy, etc., PMs are not seeable by any person - including forum staff - other than those who are in the PMs. They cannot be moderated, and who knows what vulnerable and unknowing/ignorant users would be subjected to in PMs by enemies who don't just want and don't just work, but live to hurt Humans - these last 10s of centuries can be seen as evidence for that... which would then put the responsibility squarely on JoSM, HPHC, and I presume your shoulders... and I wouldn't want to have that Karma nor responsibility...

It's a bad idea, full stop. Sorry.

 

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

Maybe some kind of combination between post count and physical amount of time since the account was created.

Anyway, thank you for this. Exact amounts could be debated endlessly with no perfect answer, but anything is a great improvement over nothing.

Great idea

 

[Ol argedco luciftias]

Something like a few months, and 50 posts. There are people who came here initially as trolls because they thought we were all nonsense, but after being here for a few months, they learned so much truth that they joined us for real. This has happened a few times. So even if a troll is determined to just wait until receiving this privilege, there is a high chance that either he will change his mind and join us, or lose interest and go away.

 

[ApolloAbove [JG]]

I understand the want to have PMs enabled, but it doesn't need to be. I think it is a bad idea altogether. 1 post, 10 posts, 100 posts, 1000 posts... as you say, a dedicated shitposter would work. Just look at majewson, as one example. By law, for data protection and privacy, etc., PMs are not seeable by any person - including forum staff - other than those who are in the PMs. They cannot be moderated, and who knows what vulnerable and unknowing/ignorant users would be subjected to in PMs by enemies who don't just want and don't just work, but live to hurt Humans - these last 10s of centuries can be seen as evidence for that... which would then put the responsibility squarely on JoSM, HPHC, and I presume your shoulders... and I wouldn't want to have that Karma nor responsibility...

It's a bad idea, full stop. Sorry.

The PMs ARE moderated. If you report a message you receive, we can take action on it. Eventually we will all work cooperatively to have a mindset of reporting suspicious posts or calls to violence. I believe a good chunk of users already do this, which is excellent. This brings the level of communication from email (which we do not control) into this forum (which we do control).

The whole point of this post was that we are ensuring newbies do NOT receive weird messages from trolls. The enemy could come and blow my head off if they had the means to, but I am still here.

 

[FancyMancy]

The PMs ARE moderated. If you report a message you receive, we can take action on it. Eventually we will all work cooperatively to have a mindset of reporting suspicious posts or calls to violence. I believe a good chunk of users already do this, which is excellent. This brings the level of communication from email (which we do not control) into this forum (which we do control).

The whole point of this post was that we are ensuring newbies do NOT receive weird messages from trolls. The enemy could come and blow my head off if they had the means to, but I am still here.

Moderated only if they are reported? I am not familiar with all laws Worldwide but I think for those which can speak English, then legally, PMs cannot be viewed by non-participants. Some won't report PMs and some won't realise a PM or the user might be dodgy. At least in the open, public forum, it can be seen and other users can give good advice; in PM, it's like going down a dark alley at night time in a bad neighbourhood. Off-forum, one themself is responsible for their online activities, presuming they're above the legal age to join any online communities, as well as the ownsers/runners of those websites/communities; on-forum, others who can are also responsible, and providing means to have private messages that are not public, of which less-than 100% will be seen by staff legally, and seen by other users, is not a good idea.

I don't know who will join, or has joined the forum already and is waiting, to target users. I'm not responsible for that nor having the Karma for that.

That's all. I am in the minority here with this. Enjoy the responsibility and Karma.

 

[Blitzkreig [JG]]

I understand the want to have PMs enabled, but it doesn't need to be. I think it is a bad idea altogether. 1 post, 10 posts, 100 posts, 1000 posts... as you say, a dedicated shitposter would work. Just look at majewson, as one example. By law, for data protection and privacy, etc., PMs are not seeable by any person - including forum staff - other than those who are in the PMs. They cannot be moderated, and who knows what vulnerable and unknowing/ignorant users would be subjected to in PMs by enemies who don't just want and don't just work, but live to hurt Humans - these last 10s of centuries can be seen as evidence for that... which would then put the responsibility squarely on JoSM, HPHC, and I presume your shoulders... and I wouldn't want to have that Karma nor responsibility...

It's a bad idea, full stop. Sorry.

Before PM's people would just use email and JoS had zero control over this. Yes, the system could be better however, and because we have access to it, we are able to make modifications to it, like what JG AA had just created.

The reality is that people will always want some sort means of private communication, and if we don't provide that, then they will look elsewhere.

 

[Ol argedco luciftias]

How are there direct messages on every single social media website that there is, if websites are not allowed to have direct messages. Direct message may be a more accurate name than private message.

This is useful for responsible people who will use it responsibly. Organizing conversations with people without it being visible to all trolls, infiltrators, and people who have no business seeing it.

 

[Henu the Great]

Moderated only if they are reported? I am not familiar with all laws Worldwide but I think for those which can speak English, then legally, PMs cannot be viewed by non-participants.

Platform owner has all the access they want and there is no illegal aspects to seeing your private messages. They own this platform, therefore it is on their discretion how this platform operates and what kind of access they want to have within this platform.

It would be another matter for an intruder to see something they are not privy to. In that case, you would be right.

The laws that are applicable to the administration are based on the country the server is resided in (server rules), and where individual administratiors operate from (operator rules), but overall this is more complicated than that.

 

[HPS Lydia]

I'm not responsible for that nor having the Karma for that.

That's all. I am in the minority here with this. Enjoy the responsibility and Karma.

You don't seem to quite understand karma.

Also, there is a karma that results from avoiding responsibilities. As people grow, we are supposed to take on responsibilities, not shirk them, which causes a stagnation in one's growth.

You have already avoided taking on responsibilities, when asked to do a task that you would have been excellent at. So enjoy your karma....

 

[AFODO]

Platform owner has all the access they want and there is no illegal aspects to seeing your private messages. They own this platform, therefore it is on their discretion how this platform operates and what kind of access they want to have within this platform.

It would be another matter for an intruder to see something they are not privy to. In that case, you would be right.

The laws that are applicable to the administration are based on the country the server is resided in (server rules), and where individual administratiors operate from (operator rules), but overall this is more complicated than that.

Perhaps a privacy police and terms of service would be needed for the forums..
---

In the DMs it says "Do not accept invites to non-JoS websites from new users. JoS does not have an official Discord server. If something seems off, report the message."
Perhaps something like this would be "Do not accept invites to non-official Joy of Satan associations. All official Joy of Satan platforms and sites are mentioned at the bottom of the forums. If something seems off, please report the message."

The "associations" can be changed to "groups" since all of these platforms have some sort of group system.

Or the last sentence to ". If there is a violation of our terms of service, please report the message." if we would have a ToS.

 

[FancyMancy]

If all PMs/DMs are always seen by all - or the relevant - staff all of the time, every single time, and laws permit that, then I withdraw my comment. I thought it was important enough to make note of.

You don't seem to quite understand karma.

Also, there is a karma that results from avoiding responsibilities. As people grow, we are supposed to take on responsibilities, not shirk them, which causes a stagnation in one's growth.

You have already avoided taking on responsibilities, when asked to do a task that you would have been excellent at. So enjoy your karma....

If you are referring to... if I remember correctly... editing official posts/sermons for the language and spelling, etc., then it was also said that we don't need grammar nazis here, so forgive me for receiving mixed messages. It was after reading that that I started calling myself Grammar Nazi in jest, albeit truth. I also don't want to have such a responsibility in this ministry because this ministry is extremely important. I prefer more competent individuals to take on such responsibilities than myself. If it is my own thing, my own project, etc., then that's fine and if I make mistakes, then OK, no problem; if it is someone else's, i.e. Satan's thing, then I don't want to do anything to make it worse, nor potentially make it worse, which includes possibly changing meanings and intentions within official sermon posts by accident, so I decided to not take on that responsibility. I did the right thing in that. If that makes my Karma hurt me, then I really don't understand Karma...

Anyway, I don't want this to be about me. I didn't mean to get off-track. Sorry for the upset.

 

[Henu the Great]

If all PMs/DMs are always seen by all - or the relevant - staff all of the time, every single time, and laws permit that, then I withdraw my comment. I thought it was important enough to make note of.

Pretty much every mainstream platform at least provides the possibility for the administration to be aware of the contents of private messaging. This is not just unique to this forum, or other forums, but is especially true for large platforms such as Instagram, Facebook, and other private messaging software. Whether that is actually used by respective administrations and moderators is another aspect of this issue.

I think you got your idea from letters, and you are right about that. In that context, around that framework, it would be illegal for anyone other than the sender and recipient to open the contents if not in all countries, then at least in most. Although that too has its limitations. For example in cases of investigations by officials.

 

[Scorpio]

I will use this thread for a certain problem (i am not sure if it has been discussed before) Some new members use their real photos on their profile as avatars. Maybe it would be worth making some note or warning to prevent them from doing it and protect them?

 

[AFODO]

I will use this thread for a certain problem (i am not sure if it has been discussed before) Some new members use their real photos on their profile as avatars. Maybe it would be worth making some note or warning to prevent them from doing it and protect them?

YES!

I also mentioned this. Also, options such as giving your birthday or anything personal should be deleted!

 

[Shadowcat]

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

 

[Caspian]

It is good that the mail option exists, since governments can actually harass ppl by going undercover and finding out someone's IP address through their email header. This has happened before in here. I'm personally grateful for this option.

YES!

I also mentioned this. Also, options such as giving your birthday or anything personal should be deleted!

Emails, too. They shouldn't be asked for imo. Refer to the above quote as to why

 

[Wotanwarrior]

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Yes, in the end I got tired and deactivated the option to receive private messages and all because someones did not like my opinion of what I should do or how I should live my personal private life and started to receive insulting messages, making fake accounts to insult other members just because they have opinions contrary to yours is really immature and pathetic.

 

[Henu the Great]

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Currently, privacy settings allow some level of control for who has what kind of posting privileges on profiles and so on. If you have not already got accustomed to those settings then by all means do so now.

 

[Ælberiigor]

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

The private message functionality (read AND write access) may be unblocked only for known members.
Some forums simply never allow anyone to use it, for security. Using of private messages service must be considered as a privilege.

 

[artzone]

...Either his electricity will be cut off, or his laptop may break down, or he may not have money to recharge his phone. You haven't considered those surprises. I was without a computer for six months, and now they're giving me one for free to rent. Ah, yes, you are not aware of such problems.

I'm hoping that my damn munka practice, Satan squares, runes.... will make a difference when I can walk out of the damn house to an unknown destination on the steppe... And if I leave, it will only be because of those damn causes of social injustice.

Something like a few months, and 50 posts. There are people who came here initially as trolls because they thought we were all nonsense, but after being here for a few months, they learned so much truth that they joined us for real. This has happened a few times. So even if a troll is determined to just wait until receiving this privilege, there is a high chance that either he will change his mind and join us, or lose interest and go away.

 

[Blitzkreig [JG]]

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Yes, in the end I got tired and deactivated the option to receive private messages and all because someones did not like my opinion of what I should do or how I should live my personal private life and started to receive insulting messages, making fake accounts to insult other members just because they have opinions contrary to yours is really immature and pathetic.

It is not right you guys have to lose out on a forum feature just because some idiot is using it against you. Please report these individuals so they can get banned, plus instantly block and leave the conversation.

There are a variety of valid instances where you could be contacted through your DM's and it would be a shame for this to be hindered. Even though people can contact you through alternative means, I have had instances of people preferring to use DM's.

 

[existentialcrisis]

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

I think the use case also has to be considered. What is the best use of DMs? Do we want newbies messaging people privately instead of joining public discourse?

Is somebody who has been around for months and posted 50 times going to make as meaningful use of the feature as someone who has posted 200 times over a year or two or more?

I think keeping the requirement low "for the newbies" would harm more than help. We get loads of newbies looking for telegrams and discords and such. They need to be kept in the open forum so that they can be steered along the right path instead of messaging some random with unknown motives to join a discord.

Same principle with typical newbie questions. Some people will message active members with basic questions instead of posting to the forum. That might shift the load unreasonably to those members, instead of giving the whole community a chance to respond.

I say keep the limit higher, 100 at least. For urgent things before this point, there are emails, which many established users give out anyway. A higher requirement will discourage trolls who are not willing to put in the effort and increase the chance that they're caught.

 

[Blitzkreig [JG]]

If all PMs/DMs are always seen by all - or the relevant - staff all of the time, every single time, and laws permit that, then I withdraw my comment. I thought it was important enough to make note of.


If you are referring to... if I remember correctly... editing official posts/sermons for the language and spelling, etc., then it was also said that we don't need grammar nazis here, so forgive me for receiving mixed messages. It was after reading that that I started calling myself Grammar Nazi in jest, albeit truth. I also don't want to have such a responsibility in this ministry because this ministry is extremely important. I prefer more competent individuals to take on such responsibilities than myself. If it is my own thing, my own project, etc., then that's fine and if I make mistakes, then OK, no problem; if it is someone else's, i.e. Satan's thing, then I don't want to do anything to make it worse, nor potentially make it worse, which includes possibly changing meanings and intentions within official sermon posts by accident, so I decided to not take on that responsibility. I did the right thing in that. If that makes my Karma hurt me, then I really don't understand Karma...

Anyway, I don't want this to be about me. I didn't mean to get off-track. Sorry for the upset.

You naturally display competency in these areas, or if you did not, you would be able to learn it. By nature of our current world, Mercurial skills are in demand, including for JoS projects. It is better to try and learn than never do so, as if you had started 1 year ago, then you would be an experienced veteran of these projects and able to direct new people, perhaps.

Just from what happened in the past, I feel you may be hung up about your place here and that could be a deeper reason that is making you avoidant. Regardless, these positions are still open, but you have to be willing to involve yourself, including resolving obstacles which may upset your ability to do otherwise good work.

 

[Lunar Dance 666]

I want to express my utter disgust here about the fact that you say PMs are moderated.

Does this mean that a mod at all times can see my private messages?

Last couple of months not only did I feel like I have been unable to express myself here, I have in fact seen messages of people encouraging others to do so. I don't think I need to explain myself here what kind of vibe that gives off.
Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

I've felt hounded and discouraged from sharing anything. I had written some poems that I wanted to share but I decided not to, because of this feeling.

And you know what. If things like this keep persisting I think I will leave the forums permanently.

This place was once part of what I considered home, but it hasn't been for a long time.

 

[Lunar Dance 666]

Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

Let me rephrase this.

Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch, on your own profile page.
After the update it was presented that being able to express yourself more was a feature added and that it was a positive thing. Having your personal space on this forum moderated violates this feeling.

 

[Ol argedco luciftias]

The direct messages are not moderated, are not approved, and are not viewed by anybody.

If you click Report and report the message as being bad, then a moderator will view the message, and will ban the account or whatever is necessary.

I hope you will stay. You are one of the important people here who has been here for many years.

 

[AFODO]

...

They can only see the message when it's reported. In any way, if you feel discomfort just from this, don't get to know how every electronics around you work. JoS and its moderators are not the first people you should worry about when it comes to your privacy.

Maybe you are going trough a sensitive period. Nothing have changed about how is the forums are moderated compared to the previous one. I would really like to read your poems and probably everybody else too.