sun/pluto

[baron_hasani]

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[f.follets]

I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.

---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

http://section520.org/14.html
It was simply declared as ratified.

Without this, the current system could not function.

The current government is based on this fraud. (Amongst others of course.)
I have actual copies of the scanned congressional records.


From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

I forgot about this one:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/138 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:15 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

I guess I should elaborate on the going public issue.
Is the difference between a baby being born & conception.
We don't use the timing of the egg being fertilized. We use the entry of the baby into the world, thus going public.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:21 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I forgot about this one:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/138 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:15 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[f.follets]

I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508

---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[f.follets]

I believe that when dealing with countries, the time of signing of the first document declaring the existence of the country (like an individual) is what counts as the "birth" of the country. The same could be said for marriages and other contracts. Conception, in this case, happens on the mind while birth is the act that manifests the idea into reality.

I always imagine that, if beginning something on a Void of Course Moon guarantees failure, it follows that the initial act (whether or not related to the moon or the planets, as this was only an example) is what counts for whatever follows afterwards, whether one acknowledges it or not.
 

---In , wrote:

I guess I should elaborate on the going public issue.
Is the difference between a baby being born & conception.
We don't use the timing of the egg being fertilized. We use the entry of the baby into the world, thus going public.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:21 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I forgot about this one:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/138 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:15 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

That chart does seem to be the most often used by many & works. What I want to know is that do other charts based on some of the list I provided work concurrently with that chart as well. And if so, which ones?

Each major event should be reflected in the original chart so one would suspect that the important ones would work as well.

Now when does the U.S. have a flipped chart for its solar return, so we can know when this current nightmare will end?

One more thing to consider. Relocation charts. Philadelphia to New York to Washington, DC.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:37 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508

---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

If a pre-natal epoch chart (conception) works for birth timing (birth chart). Then what I describe below should also work. Then the signing of the Declaration would thus be a pre-natal epoch chart? And not an actual birth chart?
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  That chart does seem to be the most often used by many & works. What I want to know is that do other charts based on some of the list I provided work concurrently with that chart as well. And if so, which ones?

Each major event should be reflected in the original chart so one would suspect that the important ones would work as well.

Now when does the U.S. have a flipped chart for its solar return, so we can know when this current nightmare will end?

One more thing to consider. Relocation charts. Philadelphia to New York to Washington, DC.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:37 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508

---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

Another example;
If you do a chart for the beginnings of say, one's career, which for most would be their first job of that skill, task, profession, etc.. Then all other job charts & partings would be reflected in the career chart as well. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:09 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  If a pre-natal epoch chart (conception) works for birth timing (birth chart). Then what I describe below should also work. Then the signing of the Declaration would thus be a pre-natal epoch chart? And not an actual birth chart?
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  That chart does seem to be the most often used by many & works. What I want to know is that do other charts based on some of the list I provided work concurrently with that chart as well. And if so, which ones?

Each major event should be reflected in the original chart so one would suspect that the important ones would work as well.

Now when does the U.S. have a flipped chart for its solar return, so we can know when this current nightmare will end?

One more thing to consider. Relocation charts. Philadelphia to New York to Washington, DC.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:37 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508

---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[f.follets]

I really haven't studied enough of mundane astrology and countries' charts to give explanations, but I do feel that, in the case of the Declaration of Independence, it really takes the role of birth rather than conception. Just like an intercourse (reflected in the pre-natal epoch chart), the convention of leaders with the common idea of independence would take the role of conception.

From this convention begins the period of "gestation" in which the document was carefully prepared. Then everything converges to the moment in which the document was officialy signed, thus giving birth to the new country.

I'm not american and I really haven't studied the US history very deeply, so I might be losing some details here.

Now, for the proper beginning of a career I believe there can only be a general idea and not a precise "birth" time. The career itself is an aggregate of activities (all of which start and end at different times) undertaken within a common professional theme, so there isn't a way to cast a chart for that... only (maybe) for the individual activities/jobs that constitute the whole and these would be limited to themselves.

---In , wrote:

Another example;
If you do a chart for the beginnings of say, one's career, which for most would be their first job of that skill, task, profession, etc.. Then all other job charts & partings would be reflected in the career chart as well. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:09 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  If a pre-natal epoch chart (conception) works for birth timing (birth chart). Then what I describe below should also work. Then the signing of the Declaration would thus be a pre-natal epoch chart? And not an actual birth chart?
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  That chart does seem to be the most often used by many & works. What I want to know is that do other charts based on some of the list I provided work concurrently with that chart as well. And if so, which ones?

Each major event should be reflected in the original chart so one would suspect that the important ones would work as well.

Now when does the U.S. have a flipped chart for its solar return, so we can know when this current nightmare will end?

One more thing to consider. Relocation charts. Philadelphia to New York to Washington, DC.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:37 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508



---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[m_18]

A career would generally, but not always, mean being compensated for services, whereas learning or training would not necessarily be. A lot depends on specifics. Paying to learn then being paid. You don't really have a career until someone pays you for it. A degree with not ever having practiced what the degree is for is not a career.



From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 7:16 AM
Subject: RE: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I really haven't studied enough of mundane astrology and countries' charts to give explanations, but I do feel that, in the case of the Declaration of Independence, it really takes the role of birth rather than conception. Just like an intercourse (reflected in the pre-natal epoch chart), the convention of leaders with the common idea of independence would take the role of conception.

From this convention begins the period of "gestation" in which the document was carefully prepared. Then everything converges to the moment in which the document was officialy signed, thus giving birth to the new country.

I'm not american and I really haven't studied the US history very deeply, so I might be losing some details here.

Now, for the proper beginning of a career I believe there can only be a general idea and not a precise "birth" time. The career itself is an aggregate of activities (all of which start and end at different times) undertaken within a common professional theme, so there isn't a way to cast a chart for that... only (maybe) for the individual activities/jobs that constitute the whole and these would be limited to themselves.

---In , wrote:

Another example;
If you do a chart for the beginnings of say, one's career, which for most would be their first job of that skill, task, profession, etc.. Then all other job charts & partings would be reflected in the career chart as well. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 5:09 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  If a pre-natal epoch chart (conception) works for birth timing (birth chart). Then what I describe below should also work. Then the signing of the Declaration would thus be a pre-natal epoch chart? And not an actual birth chart?
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  That chart does seem to be the most often used by many & works. What I want to know is that do other charts based on some of the list I provided work concurrently with that chart as well. And if so, which ones?

Each major event should be reflected in the original chart so one would suspect that the important ones would work as well.

Now when does the U.S. have a flipped chart for its solar return, so we can know when this current nightmare will end?

One more thing to consider. Relocation charts. Philadelphia to New York to Washington, DC.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:37 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I used the Declaration of Independence with the 2:13 AM time since that's what Pythia recently mentioned she uses for her predictions in a sermon from the JoS Newsletter. Here's the excerpt, and it really does seem accurate:

"In the year 2020-2021, the USA solar return has a Mars/Saturn opposition across the ascendant/descendant axis, with Mars in the first house, as was with WW2, meaning war. Jupiter happened to aspect Mars in the 1941 return and this indicated the USA would win the war; Saturn is the opposite. I have always used the Gemini ascending chart for the USA, as Satanist Benjamin Franklin who was educated in astrology and the occult had the declaration signed after 2 am, putting Uranus on the ascendant for the US Natal chart. This has held up with everything, including the September 11th attacks."
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/JoSN ... ssages/508



---In , <magus_18@... wrote:

The Soviet Union was dissolved (intentionally as the Cold War was a sham) under a transiting Pluto conjunct the natal Sun of the Bolshevik Revolution. (predicted by at least one astrologer)
 Also:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JoS_Astrology/message/149

I have additional conversations & emails from him on the topic.

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 4:08 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  The other options are:

Declaration of Independence (Secession from Great Britain)

Surrender of Cornwallis to Washington.

Treaty of Paris ending the Revolutionary War.

Articles of Confederation (We had 9 presidents under these articles. All predate Washington.)

The current U.S. constitution (which the U.S. secedes from itself)

When the Southern States walked out of Congress.

Lee surrenders to Grant.

The Federal Reserve Act in 1913. (Just had a transiting Pluto opposition Pluto - see chart in pictures of group.)

Additionally, when something goes from private to public, the time of the announcement to the public has to be critically considered as the proper time.
 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 3:47 AM
Subject: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Which chart are you going by? The U.S. started in the 1700s no longer exist. The current U.S. is based on the purported & never ratified 14th amendment.
 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:00 AM
Subject: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  I'm not experienced in mundane astrology, but the USA will indeed have an exact Sun-Pluto opposition in next year's solar return. Not only a simple opposition, there will be in fact a grand cross (two oppositions connected with squares) between Sun, Pluto, Mars and Uranus. Though not exact, I believe the Mars-Uranus opposition will play a big part as well. The fact that it's a cardinal cross also implies added impact to the events that will take place next year, whatever they may be.

This, taken all by itself, can bring much internal tension, with the possibility of oppression (Sun/Pluto) followed by rebellion (Mars/Uranus). A possible scenario is the government (or the international community) imposing oppressive measures (possibly laws, since the Sun is in the 9th house), introducing restrictions and possibly taking rights away, and people will naturally react. However, it seems reactions will be subdued because Mars is weak in Libra and in the 12th house of self-undoing and weakness. Not only that, Saturn is also in the first house contributing to the oppression and restrictions.
Neptune transiting the 10th house has been weakening the country's/government's public image (especially now that Neptune has entered Pisces), and next year, it seems, it will try to impose itself more sternly.


---In , wrote:

Hello [/IMG]</var>

 

[f.follets]

Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[m_18]

My business is architectural & structural engineering. I can't consider drawing with crayons & pencils as a pre-schooler, etc. as part of my career origins. Yet in reality, it really was.
My chart for my first job still works for my career of now over 30 years, even though that job ended a year after it began. Being paid to do something indicates that you really are no longer in training. However, one could earn something as an intern. And of course one also never stops learning. So to me, where do you make a demarcation point? Some people don't have college either. I can do what I do without college, a degree or a license in Texas with restrictions (types &/or size of projects mainly). The engineering part is limited to drafting only as a license is required for that. I have zero college except for some programing courses taken 15 years ago at a community college. Drafting was not offered in my school until 9th grade. I could have taken it in 12th, but didn't. I got my first job at 22 almost 23. Thus there was 5 years of having done absolutely nothing related to my profession. Additionally, I had all of my math credits to graduate high school by the end of the 9th grade. LOL!
The 10th house is public standing. If you have a career, then it falls under that. Not everyone has a career. Everyone does have a public standing.The 6th is simply any job (the job itself) that you have or will have & the immediate surroundings (environment) of that job. (Of course the 6th also rules the condition/health of the body as well as employees or servants if you have them. Pets are the 6th house & are actually considered servants. Some farm animals clearly are. Dogs can be used for many things.
If I ever became a professional astrologer, I wouldn't consider my first reading of horoscopes in the newspaper as my beginning. I would consider the beginning as being part of my Neptune sextile Neptune & Saturn return. However, at the time of my would be first fee, I would consider it the beginning of new my career. 

From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[m_18]

Back to Pluto/Sun. I have natal Pluto within 2 degrees of my ascendant in Virgo. I also have Mercury, the Moon & Neptune in Scorpio. Venus is barely in Sagittarius. My natal Sun is Libra & barely in Libra. I have experienced transiting Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Transiting Pluto conjunct my secondary progressed Sun. I also have had Solar Arc Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Pluto has conjuncted all of my planets now but Saturn and Mars. It will never conjunct Mars, but I will experience the opposition to it. The only opposition I will ever have from transiting Pluto. Pluto conjuncted my ascendant in retrograde after birth. (Hurricane Carla.) Pluto also conjuncted all of these midpoints as well. Pluto has been in range of conjuncting my Saturn, but has yet to be exact. It will next year. My chart is a locomotive. Death and transformation for me is simply everyday existence. I consider myself a Plutonian. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  My business is architectural & structural engineering. I can't consider drawing with crayons & pencils as a pre-schooler, etc. as part of my career origins. Yet in reality, it really was.
My chart for my first job still works for my career of now over 30 years, even though that job ended a year after it began. Being paid to do something indicates that you really are no longer in training. However, one could earn something as an intern. And of course one also never stops learning. So to me, where do you make a demarcation point? Some people don't have college either. I can do what I do without college, a degree or a license in Texas with restrictions (types &/or size of projects mainly). The engineering part is limited to drafting only as a license is required for that. I have zero college except for some programing courses taken 15 years ago at a community college. Drafting was not offered in my school until 9th grade. I could have taken it in 12th, but didn't. I got my first job at 22 almost 23. Thus there was 5 years of having done absolutely nothing related to my profession. Additionally, I had all of my math credits to graduate high school by the end of the 9th grade. LOL!
The 10th house is public standing. If you have a career, then it falls under that. Not everyone has a career. Everyone does have a public standing.The 6th is simply any job (the job itself) that you have or will have & the immediate surroundings (environment) of that job. (Of course the 6th also rules the condition/health of the body as well as employees or servants if you have them. Pets are the 6th house & are actually considered servants. Some farm animals clearly are. Dogs can be used for many things.
If I ever became a professional astrologer, I wouldn't consider my first reading of horoscopes in the newspaper as my beginning. I would consider the beginning as being part of my Neptune sextile Neptune & Saturn return. However, at the time of my would be first fee, I would consider it the beginning of new my career. 

From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[m_18]

Correction:
No conjunction of Uranus or opposition to Uranus as well. 
From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Back to Pluto/Sun. I have natal Pluto within 2 degrees of my ascendant in Virgo. I also have Mercury, the Moon & Neptune in Scorpio. Venus is barely in Sagittarius. My natal Sun is Libra & barely in Libra. I have experienced transiting Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Transiting Pluto conjunct my secondary progressed Sun. I also have had Solar Arc Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Pluto has conjuncted all of my planets now but Saturn and Mars. It will never conjunct Mars, but I will experience the opposition to it. The only opposition I will ever have from transiting Pluto. Pluto conjuncted my ascendant in retrograde after birth. (Hurricane Carla.) Pluto also conjuncted all of these midpoints as well. Pluto has been in range of conjuncting my Saturn, but has yet to be exact. It will next year. My chart is a locomotive. Death and transformation for me is simply everyday existence. I consider myself a Plutonian. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  My business is architectural & structural engineering. I can't consider drawing with crayons & pencils as a pre-schooler, etc. as part of my career origins. Yet in reality, it really was.
My chart for my first job still works for my career of now over 30 years, even though that job ended a year after it began. Being paid to do something indicates that you really are no longer in training. However, one could earn something as an intern. And of course one also never stops learning. So to me, where do you make a demarcation point? Some people don't have college either. I can do what I do without college, a degree or a license in Texas with restrictions (types &/or size of projects mainly). The engineering part is limited to drafting only as a license is required for that. I have zero college except for some programing courses taken 15 years ago at a community college. Drafting was not offered in my school until 9th grade. I could have taken it in 12th, but didn't. I got my first job at 22 almost 23. Thus there was 5 years of having done absolutely nothing related to my profession. Additionally, I had all of my math credits to graduate high school by the end of the 9th grade. LOL!
The 10th house is public standing. If you have a career, then it falls under that. Not everyone has a career. Everyone does have a public standing.The 6th is simply any job (the job itself) that you have or will have & the immediate surroundings (environment) of that job. (Of course the 6th also rules the condition/health of the body as well as employees or servants if you have them. Pets are the 6th house & are actually considered servants. Some farm animals clearly are. Dogs can be used for many things.
If I ever became a professional astrologer, I wouldn't consider my first reading of horoscopes in the newspaper as my beginning. I would consider the beginning as being part of my Neptune sextile Neptune & Saturn return. However, at the time of my would be first fee, I would consider it the beginning of new my career. 

From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[f.follets]

Those are some extremely intense transits and progressions. I can't even imagine how a hard Pluto transit really hits, despite having strong natal aspects to Pluto. 

My first hard Pluto transit is arriving though, as it slowly begins to square my Aries Sun. Not only that, I will have Uranus conjunct my Sun, Neptune conjunct natal Saturn at about the same time, with the nodes tying in. I expect some serious developments to follow, especially with Uranus involved going back and forth conjunct my Sun. My life will definitely not be the same after this.

---In , wrote:

Correction:
No conjunction of Uranus or opposition to Uranus as well. 
From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Back to Pluto/Sun. I have natal Pluto within 2 degrees of my ascendant in Virgo. I also have Mercury, the Moon & Neptune in Scorpio. Venus is barely in Sagittarius. My natal Sun is Libra & barely in Libra. I have experienced transiting Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Transiting Pluto conjunct my secondary progressed Sun. I also have had Solar Arc Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Pluto has conjuncted all of my planets now but Saturn and Mars. It will never conjunct Mars, but I will experience the opposition to it. The only opposition I will ever have from transiting Pluto. Pluto conjuncted my ascendant in retrograde after birth. (Hurricane Carla.) Pluto also conjuncted all of these midpoints as well. Pluto has been in range of conjuncting my Saturn, but has yet to be exact. It will next year. My chart is a locomotive. Death and transformation for me is simply everyday existence. I consider myself a Plutonian. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  My business is architectural & structural engineering. I can't consider drawing with crayons & pencils as a pre-schooler, etc. as part of my career origins. Yet in reality, it really was.
My chart for my first job still works for my career of now over 30 years, even though that job ended a year after it began. Being paid to do something indicates that you really are no longer in training. However, one could earn something as an intern. And of course one also never stops learning. So to me, where do you make a demarcation point? Some people don't have college either. I can do what I do without college, a degree or a license in Texas with restrictions (types &/or size of projects mainly). The engineering part is limited to drafting only as a license is required for that. I have zero college except for some programing courses taken 15 years ago at a community college. Drafting was not offered in my school until 9th grade. I could have taken it in 12th, but didn't. I got my first job at 22 almost 23. Thus there was 5 years of having done absolutely nothing related to my profession. Additionally, I had all of my math credits to graduate high school by the end of the 9th grade. LOL!
The 10th house is public standing. If you have a career, then it falls under that. Not everyone has a career. Everyone does have a public standing.The 6th is simply any job (the job itself) that you have or will have & the immediate surroundings (environment) of that job. (Of course the 6th also rules the condition/health of the body as well as employees or servants if you have them. Pets are the 6th house & are actually considered servants. Some farm animals clearly are. Dogs can be used for many things.
If I ever became a professional astrologer, I wouldn't consider my first reading of horoscopes in the newspaper as my beginning. I would consider the beginning as being part of my Neptune sextile Neptune & Saturn return. However, at the time of my would be first fee, I would consider it the beginning of new my career. 

From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[m_18]

That's my life, so what can I say?

You will enjoy Uranus to your Sun. You will not be bored to say the least.

 
From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2013 4:07 AM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Those are some extremely intense transits and progressions. I can't even imagine how a hard Pluto transit really hits, despite having strong natal aspects to Pluto. 

My first hard Pluto transit is arriving though, as it slowly begins to square my Aries Sun. Not only that, I will have Uranus conjunct my Sun, Neptune conjunct natal Saturn at about the same time, with the nodes tying in. I expect some serious developments to follow, especially with Uranus involved going back and forth conjunct my Sun. My life will definitely not be the same after this.

---In , wrote:

Correction:
No conjunction of Uranus or opposition to Uranus as well. 
From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Back to Pluto/Sun. I have natal Pluto within 2 degrees of my ascendant in Virgo. I also have Mercury, the Moon & Neptune in Scorpio. Venus is barely in Sagittarius. My natal Sun is Libra & barely in Libra. I have experienced transiting Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Transiting Pluto conjunct my secondary progressed Sun. I also have had Solar Arc Pluto conjunct my natal Sun. Pluto has conjuncted all of my planets now but Saturn and Mars. It will never conjunct Mars, but I will experience the opposition to it. The only opposition I will ever have from transiting Pluto. Pluto conjuncted my ascendant in retrograde after birth. (Hurricane Carla.) Pluto also conjuncted all of these midpoints as well. Pluto has been in range of conjuncting my Saturn, but has yet to be exact. It will next year. My chart is a locomotive. Death and transformation for me is simply everyday existence. I consider myself a Plutonian. 

From: m_18 <magus_18@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  My business is architectural & structural engineering. I can't consider drawing with crayons & pencils as a pre-schooler, etc. as part of my career origins. Yet in reality, it really was.
My chart for my first job still works for my career of now over 30 years, even though that job ended a year after it began. Being paid to do something indicates that you really are no longer in training. However, one could earn something as an intern. And of course one also never stops learning. So to me, where do you make a demarcation point? Some people don't have college either. I can do what I do without college, a degree or a license in Texas with restrictions (types &/or size of projects mainly). The engineering part is limited to drafting only as a license is required for that. I have zero college except for some programing courses taken 15 years ago at a community college. Drafting was not offered in my school until 9th grade. I could have taken it in 12th, but didn't. I got my first job at 22 almost 23. Thus there was 5 years of having done absolutely nothing related to my profession. Additionally, I had all of my math credits to graduate high school by the end of the 9th grade. LOL!
The 10th house is public standing. If you have a career, then it falls under that. Not everyone has a career. Everyone does have a public standing.The 6th is simply any job (the job itself) that you have or will have & the immediate surroundings (environment) of that job. (Of course the 6th also rules the condition/health of the body as well as employees or servants if you have them. Pets are the 6th house & are actually considered servants. Some farm animals clearly are. Dogs can be used for many things.
If I ever became a professional astrologer, I wouldn't consider my first reading of horoscopes in the newspaper as my beginning. I would consider the beginning as being part of my Neptune sextile Neptune & Saturn return. However, at the time of my would be first fee, I would consider it the beginning of new my career. 

From: "f.follets@..." <f.follets@...
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: Re: Re: [JoS_Astrology] RE: sun/pluto

  Well, this is way out of topic lol, but I have to disagree. Though I agree that a degree that was never used does not make a career, the career is a much broader concept than just having a job, or even having a job and being compensated for it.

Rather, the career is a path one follows in life which, of course, shines through the professional side but is composed of many other things such as studies (skills/knowledge to practice an activity), social position, contacts with other people as well as the job and the money. A person following an academic career can surely be considered starting a career from the beginning of his/her undergraduate course, for example, as it would be considered the very first step.

The 10th house trines the 6th and the 2nd but does not rely on them for its concept to exist, therefore the career does not depend intrinsically on the job or the money even if they are parts of it. The compensation definitely isn't so important to define a career since it invariably comes from others and isn't really self-generated: the second house from the 10th is the 11th house of large groups of people and the second from the 6th is the 7th of the associates or clients.

 

[f.follets]

Speaking of which, I (kinda) accidentally found your radio show a few days ago and I must say it's pretty neat!

Kudos on the show and keep it going.

---In , wrote:

That's my life, so what can I say?

You will enjoy Uranus to your Sun. You will not be bored to say the least.