IMPORTANT: Changes to New Accounts and Private Messages

Shadowcat wrote:

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Yes, in the end I got tired and deactivated the option to receive private messages and all because someones did not like my opinion of what I should do or how I should live my personal private life and started to receive insulting messages, making fake accounts to insult other members just because they have opinions contrary to yours is really immature and pathetic.

Shadowcat wrote:

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Currently, privacy settings allow some level of control for who has what kind of posting privileges on profiles and so on. If you have not already got accustomed to those settings then by all means do so now.

ApolloAbove [JG] wrote:

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

The private message functionality (read AND write access) may be unblocked only for known members.
Some forums simply never allow anyone to use it, for security. Using of private messages service must be considered as a privilege.

Shadowcat wrote:

I have mentioned in the beginning of the new forum boot that I felt DM's were a bad Idea. I had people post on my profile that I didn't want and someone DM'd me who was trying to harass me for a long time and kept going around blocks that I finally got fed up with and put a stop to and threatened to have them banned. I also remember seeing recently that Wotanworrior had someone constantly harassing him with hatemail in his DM box (I think they kept making new accounts)

Wotanwarrior wrote:View source

Yes, in the end I got tired and deactivated the option to receive private messages and all because someones did not like my opinion of what I should do or how I should live my personal private life and started to receive insulting messages, making fake accounts to insult other members just because they have opinions contrary to yours is really immature and pathetic.

It is not right you guys have to lose out on a forum feature just because some idiot is using it against you. Please report these individuals so they can get banned, plus instantly block and leave the conversation.

There are a variety of valid instances where you could be contacted through your DM's and it would be a shame for this to be hindered. Even though people can contact you through alternative means, I have had instances of people preferring to use DM's.

ApolloAbove [JG] wrote:

If we set it to 100 posts, it would be the same thing would it not? Truly dedicated shitposters and trolls will spend days infiltrating a place. We will just keep upping the post count required, but it should not inhibit newbies either.

I think the use case also has to be considered. What is the best use of DMs? Do we want newbies messaging people privately instead of joining public discourse?

Is somebody who has been around for months and posted 50 times going to make as meaningful use of the feature as someone who has posted 200 times over a year or two or more?

I think keeping the requirement low "for the newbies" would harm more than help. We get loads of newbies looking for telegrams and discords and such. They need to be kept in the open forum so that they can be steered along the right path instead of messaging some random with unknown motives to join a discord.

Same principle with typical newbie questions. Some people will message active members with basic questions instead of posting to the forum. That might shift the load unreasonably to those members, instead of giving the whole community a chance to respond.

I say keep the limit higher, 100 at least. For urgent things before this point, there are emails, which many established users give out anyway. A higher requirement will discourage trolls who are not willing to put in the effort and increase the chance that they're caught.

I want to express my utter disgust here about the fact that you say PMs are moderated.

Does this mean that a mod at all times can see my private messages?

Last couple of months not only did I feel like I have been unable to express myself here, I have in fact seen messages of people encouraging others to do so. I don't think I need to explain myself here what kind of vibe that gives off.
Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

I've felt hounded and discouraged from sharing anything. I had written some poems that I wanted to share but I decided not to, because of this feeling.

And you know what. If things like this keep persisting I think I will leave the forums permanently.

This place was once part of what I considered home, but it hasn't been for a long time.

Lunar Dance 666 wrote:View source

Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

Let me rephrase this.

Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch, on your own profile page.
After the update it was presented that being able to express yourself more was a feature added and that it was a positive thing. Having your personal space on this forum moderated violates this feeling.

The direct messages are not moderated, are not approved, and are not viewed by anybody.

If you click Report and report the message as being bad, then a moderator will view the message, and will ban the account or whatever is necessary.

I hope you will stay. You are one of the important people here who has been here for many years.

Lunar Dance 666 wrote:View source

...

They can only see the message when it's reported. In any way, if you feel discomfort just from this, don't get to know how every electronics around you work. ToZ and its moderators are not the first people you should worry about when it comes to your privacy.

Maybe you are going trough a sensitive period. Nothing have changed about how is the forums are moderated compared to the previous one. I would really like to read your poems and probably everybody else too.

Lunar Dance 666 wrote:View source

I want to express my utter disgust here about the fact that you say PMs are moderated.

Does this mean that a mod at all times can see my private messages?

Last couple of months not only did I feel like I have been unable to express myself here, I have in fact seen messages of people encouraging others to do so. I don't think I need to explain myself here what kind of vibe that gives off.
Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

I've felt hounded and discouraged from sharing anything. I had written some poems that I wanted to share but I decided not to, because of this feeling.

And you know what. If things like this keep persisting I think I will leave the forums permanently.

This place was once part of what I considered home, but it hasn't been for a long time.

No, we are all out doing things beyond watching people talk back and forth every day. The conversations are private, but we have the ability to deal with troublemakers now. The people in charge of protecting ToZ from the inside are literally chosen by HP, and by extent, the Gods. This isn't some totalitarian Big Brother surveillance state.

We ONLY and EXCLUSIVELY look at messages if they are reported by a conversation participant. Otherwise we do not know if you are being bullied or harassed by someone, which is where the push to now report trolls comes from.

Lunar Dance 666 wrote:View source

I want to express my utter disgust here about the fact that you say PMs are moderated.

Does this mean that a mod at all times can see my private messages?

Last couple of months not only did I feel like I have been unable to express myself here, I have in fact seen messages of people encouraging others to do so. I don't think I need to explain myself here what kind of vibe that gives off.
Everything that is public is moderated. Even the things that where you are supposed to be able to put a personal touch. Which is what it was presented at, as first when the forum was updated.

I've felt hounded and discouraged from sharing anything. I had written some poems that I wanted to share but I decided not to, because of this feeling.

And you know what. If things like this keep persisting I think I will leave the forums permanently.

This place was once part of what I considered home, but it hasn't been for a long time.

Nobody has an interest in viewing your personal messages, and not even the mods can do so.
It's only possible to read a message if your conversation partner klicks on the "report" button a page.

I am sure that secret services, however, will be able to read any message here.

Lunar Dance 666 wrote:View source

And you know what. If things like this keep persisting I think I will leave the forums permanently.

This place was once part of what I considered home, but it hasn't been for a long time.

I had read some of your posts and enjoyed them, so I hope you'll stick around here and share your poetry someday with us, when you feel like doing it

Blitzkreig [JG] wrote:View source

It is not right you guys have to lose out on a forum feature just because some idiot is using it against you. Please report these individuals so they can get banned, plus instantly block and leave the conversation.

There are a variety of valid instances where you could be contacted through your DM's and it would be a shame for this to be hindered. Even though people can contact you through alternative means, I have had instances of people preferring to use DM's.

Thank you very much, I want to avoid at all costs that troll attacks cause distrust and division with other members.

Henu the Great wrote:View source

Pretty much every mainstream platform at least provides the possibility for the administration to be aware of the contents of private messaging. This is not just unique to this forum, or other forums, but is especially true for large platforms such as Instagram, Facebook, and other private messaging software. Whether that is actually used by respective administrations and moderators is another aspect of this issue.

I think you got your idea from letters, and you are right about that. In that context, around that framework, it would be illegal for anyone other than the sender and recipient to open the contents if not in all countries, then at least in most. Although that too has its limitations. For example in cases of investigations by officials.

I have been on forums (and in the past, chatrooms) for years. On at least one of those, it was said that PMs were vieweable by only the participants, so that's where I got this from. It's quite a sticky topic. Off-forum, off-ToZ websites, people are responsible for themselves. On here... it's difficult...

Blitzkreig [JG] wrote:

You naturally display competency in these areas, or if you did not, you would be able to learn it. By nature of our current world, Mercurial skills are in demand, including for ToZ projects. It is better to try and learn than never do so, as if you had started 1 year ago, then you would be an experienced veteran of these projects and able to direct new people, perhaps.

Just from what happened in the past, I feel you may be hung up about your place here and that could be a deeper reason that is making you avoidant. Regardless, these positions are still open, but you have to be willing to involve yourself, including resolving obstacles which may upset your ability to do otherwise good work.

Thanks for your reply.