TopoftheAbyss said:Two planets 110 degrees apart are still trine?
13th_Wolf said:Conjunctions with Saturn are full 30 degrees if it is in the same sign.
Hail Azazel unt Beelzebul!
People with Saturn in Aries have trouble asserting themselves and can have a pessimistic, timid nature. Many times, they tend to hold their anger inside. They can be overly cautious and afraid to take any chances. Other planets in Aries [especially if not in conjunction with the Saturn], a strongly placed Mars and Jupiter can offset these tendencies. This placement can give a lack of confidence and low self-esteem. Unless other factors in the chart contradict this, Saturn in Aries can sap one's vitality and energy. Quite often, the first half of the life is more difficult than the later years.
Powstanie Pogańskie said:13th_Wolf said:Conjunctions with Saturn are full 30 degrees if it is in the same sign.
Hail Azazel unt Beelzebul!
I'm not entirely certain that this is true, as I've not stumbled upon this bit of info before and it puzzles me. It also seems like it would contradict this bit of information on Azazel's Astrology regarding Saturn in Aries:
People with Saturn in Aries have trouble asserting themselves and can have a pessimistic, timid nature. Many times, they tend to hold their anger inside. They can be overly cautious and afraid to take any chances. Other planets in Aries [especially if not in conjunction with the Saturn], a strongly placed Mars and Jupiter can offset these tendencies. This placement can give a lack of confidence and low self-esteem. Unless other factors in the chart contradict this, Saturn in Aries can sap one's vitality and energy. Quite often, the first half of the life is more difficult than the later years.
13th_Wolf said:I exaggerated, I had an idea about certain planets being in the same sign as others by a wide aspect that could influence one another, but its in more of a "whole" sense not necessarily about the exact bodies individually, but the processes of the sign they're in as a whole. It's not definite, I got a bit excited.
HPS Maxine gave I think on the yahoo groups, to allow for a wider orb for Saturn due to what it represents. Not 30 degrees, but anywhere reasonable above 10 degrees definitely. It's definitely not a conjunction past a point, nor beyond 10 degrees would it operate like an actual one.
I meant that more in the terms of dynamics of how a whole sign with planets in disparate areas of the sign might work which is an unexplored and unresearched area, my mistake. I think any kind of insight into that would have to look into each of the planets following the Cardinal-Fixed-Mutable rule. Saturn is considered because it's a Cardinal acting planet, so I guess the Moon, Venus and Mars could have a similar thing about them, although this isn't in terms of the regular conjunction description.
If minor aspects where these planets are seemingly non-related to eachother can indicate patterns about how someone is going to develop on a deep level, and every planet and star in this universe influences one another (with regards to us also) even in some meagre way like each a gust of wind to another, within reason, you still should consider it. If planets are in the same sign allotment I think that analogy should definitely apply, although the planets definitely aren't "conjunct" by the observable truth of course. There's still this more disparate and subtle influence between is what I'm saying. Like this 110' Trine aspect is still a functioning influence in technical terms, but mostly pointless for understanding anything direct and objective.
But yeah you're right to correct me on that brother . Saturn in the 30 degree range isn't an actual conjunction only a weighting influence on the affairs of the sign/house, which is dependent on the decan it resides in probably.
TopoftheAbyss said:Nevermind actually, it says that the primary ruler of the ascendant is the chart ruler.
That information describes me but my Saturn is in Taurus.Powstanie Pogańskie said:13th_Wolf said:Conjunctions with Saturn are full 30 degrees if it is in the same sign.
Hail Azazel unt Beelzebul!
I'm not entirely certain that this is true, as I've not stumbled upon this bit of info before and it puzzles me. It also seems like it would contradict this bit of information on Azazel's Astrology regarding Saturn in Aries:
People with Saturn in Aries have trouble asserting themselves and can have a pessimistic, timid nature. Many times, they tend to hold their anger inside. They can be overly cautious and afraid to take any chances. Other planets in Aries [especially if not in conjunction with the Saturn], a strongly placed Mars and Jupiter can offset these tendencies. This placement can give a lack of confidence and low self-esteem. Unless other factors in the chart contradict this, Saturn in Aries can sap one's vitality and energy. Quite often, the first half of the life is more difficult than the later years.
TopoftheAbyss said:That information describes me but my Saturn is in Taurus.Powstanie Pogańskie said:13th_Wolf said:Conjunctions with Saturn are full 30 degrees if it is in the same sign.
Hail Azazel unt Beelzebul!
I'm not entirely certain that this is true, as I've not stumbled upon this bit of info before and it puzzles me. It also seems like it would contradict this bit of information on Azazel's Astrology regarding Saturn in Aries:
People with Saturn in Aries have trouble asserting themselves and can have a pessimistic, timid nature. Many times, they tend to hold their anger inside. They can be overly cautious and afraid to take any chances. Other planets in Aries [especially if not in conjunction with the Saturn], a strongly placed Mars and Jupiter can offset these tendencies. This placement can give a lack of confidence and low self-esteem. Unless other factors in the chart contradict this, Saturn in Aries can sap one's vitality and energy. Quite often, the first half of the life is more difficult than the later years.
Yeah I have Saturn square Mars.13th_Wolf said:TopoftheAbyss said:That information describes me but my Saturn is in Taurus.Powstanie Pogańskie said:I'm not entirely certain that this is true, as I've not stumbled upon this bit of info before and it puzzles me. It also seems like it would contradict this bit of information on Azazel's Astrology regarding Saturn in Aries:
Check the relationship between your Saturn and Mars. Aspects especially if tight between planets, can play off the same way as a planet in a sign. For example a tight Jupiter/Neptune aspect compares with the description of Jupiter in Pisces etc.
I also had some similarities with that description but no such placement or aspect above either. There are also other things to consider like overemphasises of weak stuff, retrogrades, cadent 3rd 9th 6th and 12th houses and other conditions which can lead to feeling in common with the description of Saturn in Aries as well as the descriptions of anything else particularly.
I believe also (and this is not defined yet) that if a planet is placed in the same sign quadrant as the sign in question (like in Taurus which proceeds from Aries within the same quadrant) then there may be some commonalities you'll find in that planet with its placement in the other 2 signs in that same quadrant. The 1st quadrant is Aries - Gemini, 2nd Cancer - Virgo, 3rd Libra - Sagittarius and 4th Capricorn - Pisces. Then there are the quadrants defined by the house placements of an individual chart on that day, which fluctuate for each individual, but for the static zodiacal quadrant system, that's the order.
If one has a Mars in Aquarius, they may find some similarity with the description of Mars in Capricorn in the Preceding sense, Mars in Pisces in the Proceeding sense. As one example.
TopoftheAbyss said:Yeah I have Saturn square Mars.
13th_Wolf said:TopoftheAbyss said:That information describes me but my Saturn is in Taurus.Powstanie Pogańskie said:I'm not entirely certain that this is true, as I've not stumbled upon this bit of info before and it puzzles me. It also seems like it would contradict this bit of information on Azazel's Astrology regarding Saturn in Aries:
Check the relationship between your Saturn and Mars. Aspects especially if tight between planets, can play off the same way as a planet in a sign. For example a tight Jupiter/Neptune aspect compares with the description of Jupiter in Pisces etc.
I also had some similarities with that description but no such placement or aspect above either. There are also other things to consider like overemphasises of weak stuff, retrogrades, cadent 3rd 9th 6th and 12th houses and other conditions which can lead to feeling in common with the description of Saturn in Aries as well as the descriptions of anything else particularly.
I believe also (and this is not defined yet) that if a planet is placed in the same sign quadrant as the sign in question (like in Taurus which proceeds from Aries within the same quadrant) then there may be some commonalities you'll find in that planet with its placement in the other 2 signs in that same quadrant. The 1st quadrant is Aries - Gemini, 2nd Cancer - Virgo, 3rd Libra - Sagittarius and 4th Capricorn - Pisces. Then there are the quadrants defined by the house placements of an individual chart on that day, which fluctuate for each individual, but for the static zodiacal quadrant system, that's the order.
If one has a Mars in Aquarius, they may find some similarity with the description of Mars in Capricorn in the Preceding sense, Mars in Pisces in the Proceeding sense. As one example.
Powstanie Pogańskie said:I have a very recent example of a person whose Venus is exactly conjunct their Pluto in Sagittarius - exact same degree and everything. While they identified strongly with the description of Venus in Sagittarius, they just as well identified with Venus in Scorpio. This temporarily lead them to believe in that whole thing about the constellations shifting so now the dates are all wrong and we actually have our planets shifted back twenty-something degrees or some such, as this idea places their Venus in Scorpio. Said individual also has a 12th House Mars aspecting their Aries Saturn and their Neptune - they consequently identified strongly with Saturn in Pisces. It lead to a very interesting back-and-forth about how aspects and House placements color things, and that it's easy to read on Azazel's Astrology about needing to take the entire chart into account and not just the sign placements listed there - but actually working out an example like this with somebody, that's critical experience.
13th_Wolf said:I had a friend with a Sun/Moon conjunction in Aries, who could be described as Cancerian. His mother died early on and he was very energetic and aggressive, but revealed himself to be a lot more defensive and emotional when he matured (the aggression came from that, his 12th house Mars also was actually placed pretty weak, and interestingly absence of Water placements).
It's a pretty logical conclusion I think, but the difference between sign placements and planetary conjunctions is that the latter are considering more active and more dynamic literal energy, instead of a sign and all the distant energies from stars within the sign. The planets are very important for us because physically, they influence right here to a very high degree. I would say it would be better to put the planets first and the signs second lol, instead of how people often want to compare signs etc. They are the actual acting forces pushing their energy onto us.
One thing that interests me is whether a certain planet would "dominate" over another in a conjunction (one planet makes another like it's ruling sign, but it itself remains of independent expression) and that most likely it could be gauged from the quality of the planet with Cardinal planets being the strongest. With Venus and Mars conjunction though, it presents a problem in that they both rule the same quality (along with say Saturn/Mars, Jupiter/Mercury etc.) and with the above example of a Sun/Moon, there are strong elements of a Moon in Leo description to the person as well as Sun Cancer. The science of how the planets blend and change eachother appears to be pretty complex from the mostly subjective viewpoint we are at right now.
One idea too is whether one could find this similarity to sign descriptions in that light, during progressions and/or transits. A Sun/Venus progression making someone as Sun in Taurus/Libra? Well, doesn't that just sound like the natural condition of love, relationships, Venus etc. ? :lol: :lol: That's how you become during that particular period. And what is a Sun/Mars progression? Athleticism, high energy and aggression. Sun/Pluto transit you would feel like a Scorpio at that point (along with the nervous exhaustion of course). It all comes full circle.
This person's Venus/Pluto conjunction in Sagittarius, if they were a Sun Scorpio or maybe also Libra; the fact their Sun precedes this aspect means that in progression whether it's when they are in their 30's or 60's, when they have their love time they are also gonna be pretty damn sexual too :lol: , but also potentially it would be a rough time.
The same would apply if their Sun proceeded from this conjunction, but to a lesser degree as it would be a square then. Still the same thing you would have to consider though.
Hail Azazel!
"It is my desire that all my followers unite in a bond of unity, lest those who are without prevail against them." - Satan